Sexual abuse by teachers and coverage in the News

[dutchguylivingintheuk]

Now - I should point out that my daughter went to his school when she was younger so I have a personal interest. I was also a teacher for many years further along the North Wale Coast and lived in Bangor so I knew a lot of people connected to Education in the area - and we heard a lot of strange stories about him - nothing sexual but bullying and assault (of pupils and staff) that no other teacher or Head would have dared to even think of doing - but they were just stories - maybe?

No i don't think so, being an bully allows him to overpower, in this example students and teachers leading to different boundaries to him, leading to exploiting's those who are the weakest in this case little girls.

Anyway - interesting comparison - female teacher has sex with 2 pupils - lots of coverage nationally
Male Head teacher sexually assault several girls at his school - less coverage except locally



Both massively inappropriate and deserving of heavy punishment - but the difference in coverage is interesting???

Well the thing is Women sexually abusing students is relatively new, where as males sexaully abusing girls sadly isn't really news.

 

[Ian H]

No i don't think so, being an bully allows him to overpower, in this example students and teachers leading to different boundaries to him, leading to exploiting's those who are the weakest in this case little girls.

Well the thing is Women sexually abusing students is relatively new, where as males sexaully abusing girls sadly isn't really news.

It's not new. It's rare, but not new.

 

[Rusty Nails]

You only have to see the architecture at Poundland Poundbury or look at his new portrait to see he never had taste.

Not like wot I have got.

 

[Bromptonaut]

Similar thing happened at my school. Male teacher aged 32 was having affair with female student aged 16. It was going on for a while, until they were found out. He was asked to resign. Nothing in the local news or anything (this was mid 90's though). If they are pupils then it's a safeguarding issue. If under 16 then it's more serious. But I think an older male will always be viewed as more predatory because that sells more papers

Chap who taught my daughter at 15+ and went to Ecuador with a mixed group on World Challenge ended up in gaol over an affair with a 6th former at a school in Rugby. Met him a few times on fund raisers and training events and honestly he was the last person I'd have thought of as being a sex offender.

I think it was a genuine thing that obviously should not have happened.

When I was at school in the seventies sixth formers were fair game for (mostly) male teachers fairly fresh out of Uni.

My daughter's in laws met when he was a sixth former and she an RE teacher - she is a lifelong friend of my partner. Married, still married, and had two kids together.

 

[monkers]

It's not new. It's rare, but not new.

I wouldn't say it is rare. There are quite a number of female teachers struck off in the UK every year in sexual abuse cases. Transcripts of the hearings are posted on-line, but few cases make the national press.

Prison sentences for serious sexual assault are not varied by sex, but it does seem that men are much more likely to face a jury than women for similar crimes, and then more likely to go to prison. I'd like to see a research paper on it.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Prison sentences for serious sexual assault are not varied by sex, but it does seem that men are much more likely to face a jury than women for similar crimes, and then more likely to go to prison. I'd like to see a research paper on it.

We have a hundred years of crime statistics that show very clearly that men overwhelmingly comit nearly all sex crimes. In every country that keeps records. It's ridiculous to suggest female sex offender convictions are even remotely near the level of male offending.

There are hundreds of research papers on it. There are whole academic journals dedicated to studying sex offending. Conviction rates are not an understudied area. The issue is why men comit crimes of a sexual nature and how to prevent it, not whether they commit most of them, because we all know they do.

 

[monkers]

We have a hundred years of crime statistics that show very clearly that men overwhelmingly comit nearly all sex crimes. In every country that keeps records. It's ridiculous to suggest female sex offender convictions are even remotely near the level of male offending.

There are hundreds of research papers on it. There are whole academic journals dedicated to studying sex offending. Conviction rates are not an understudied area. The issue is why men comit crimes of a sexual nature and how to prevent it, not whether they commit most of them, because we all know they do.

I wonder you are so keen to suppress the idea that women are offenders too.

There is some data available. When I present data you willfully misrepresent it. When I published the data for London, you claimed that the data for the rest of country was certain to be much different - without even seeing the data for anywhere else.

What we can read into the data is that women are offenders too; that even when arrested they are much less likely to be charged, and if charged they are less likely to be found guilty, and even when found guilty they are less likely to go to prison. The data also suggest that women are more likely to go to prison for (I forget the term and N is not here to help) for prosecutions brought by bodies such as TV Licensing.

If you could link to research papers that would be helpful.

 

[Ian H]

Court records won't tell the whole story. This little snippet, as told by Norman Cameron to Geoffrey Grigson, occurred sometime around 80-90 years ago.

 

[BoldonLad]

We have a hundred years of crime statistics that show very clearly that men overwhelmingly comit nearly all sex crimes. In every country that keeps records. It's ridiculous to suggest female sex offender convictions are even remotely near the level of male offending.

There are hundreds of research papers on it. There are whole academic journals dedicated to studying sex offending. Conviction rates are not an understudied area. The issue is why men comit crimes of a sexual nature and how to prevent it, not whether they commit most of them, because we all know they do.

This may, or may not be true, but, if we cannot be certain both groups (men and women) are treated in the same way when it comes to reporting, prosecution, conviction and sentencing, I don't see how we can be sure.

I don't have any figures to support it, but, I would guess that school boys are much much less likely to report an errant female teacher, and, that is only one factor.

 

[monkers]

This may, or may not be true, but, if we cannot be certain both groups (men and women) are treated in the same way when it comes to reporting, prosecution, conviction and sentencing, I don't see how we can be sure.

I don't have any figures to support it, but, I would guess that school boys are much much less likely to report an errant female teacher, and, that is only one factor.

In my own experience in education, colleagues are more likely to report misconduct than the learners themselves. I have been in the unfortunate position of having to report colleagues to police while a head. I have otherwise seen cases of 'touching' by female colleagues as being justified as something other than sexual abuse, being portrayed as 'caring'. It's sometimes almost as if sexual abuse is not damaging if perpetuated by females.

I didn't have to look far back in records to see this case ...

https://assets.publishing.service.g...4007696fca732/Barker__Carol_SOS_Decision_.pdf

 

[AuroraSaab]

I wonder you are so keen to suppress the idea that women are offenders too.

I'm not suppressing it. I'm correcting your continual sly suggestions that women are as bad as men in terms of violent and sexual offending.

There is some data available. When I present data you willfully misrepresent it. When I published the data for London, you claimed that the data for the rest of country was certain to be much different - without even seeing the data for anywhere else.

You found one offence, in one age group, in one location (London), in one year, where arrests were higher for females than males. The national data, year after year, showed a different picture.

What we can read into the data is that women are offenders too; that even when arrested they are much less likely to be charged, and if charged they are less likely to be found guilty, and even when found guilty they are less likely to go to prison.

The very obvious reason for this is that women often have children to care for, or are carers for a partner or elderly parents. There's a link between crime and poverty so there will be a large number of single mothers amongst those women charged with offences. This will be a mitigating factor in deciding whether to imprison.

If you could link to research papers that would be helpful.

There's plenty, use Google. I don't doubt that women are less harshly treated than men by the justice system in some respects, and more harshly in others. This has nothing to do with your assertion that there isn't much difference in rates of offending for violent and sexual crime between the sexes.

 

[monkers]

I'm not suppressing it. I'm correcting your continual sly suggestions that women are as bad as men in terms of violent and sexual offending.

Nowhere have I said that ''woman are as bad as men''. I have not said or slyly suggested it. This is so typical of you.

What I am saying in a forthright manner is that to suppose the people are safe with women and unsafe with men is entirely false. I am also saying that women are much less likely to be reported, prosecuted and sentenced than men. Most typically women receive shorter sentences than men for the same offence. There can arguably be good reasons for this to do with self defence, motherhood, caring for other dependents, but there is not enough evidence from the data to say 'women good, men bad'.

Julie Morris: Wigan deputy head teacher jailed for raping girl​

• • Published
    22 December 2021
  
  Julie Morris was the school safeguarding officer working in league with her male partner.
  
  https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-59754035

 

[monkers]

There's plenty, use Google. I don't doubt that women are less harshly treated than men by the justice system in some respects, and more harshly in others. This has nothing to do with your assertion that there isn't much difference in rates of offending for violent and sexual crime between the sexes.

That is not forum or debating etiquette. If you claim something can be substantiated then you must be prepared to back it up. Otherwise anyone can claim any old nonsense as facts.

 

[monkers]

The very obvious reason for this is that women often have children to care for, or are carers for a partner or elderly parents. There's a link between crime and poverty so there will be a large number of single mothers amongst those women charged with offences. This will be a mitigating factor in deciding whether to imprison.

I agree these are reasonable factors. However to then claim that prison stats show that men are so many times more violent or abusive than men (as you tend to do) is nonsense.

 

[monkers]

This has nothing to do with your assertion that there isn't much difference in rates of offending for violent and sexual crime between the sexes.

I have said no such thing. And there it is again, you just making stuff up. When will you stop?

Who is more likely to physically intervene on the sight of a man abusing a woman, another man, or another woman?