Starmer's vision quest

[TailWindHome]

Are British muslims less entitled than British christians, or British jews or British atheists to vote based on foreign policy?

 

[secretsqirrel]

There was a perfect vox pop this morning from two Reform voters in Wales. Asked why he didn't vote Labour, one said, "Well, it was that they did to us in lockdown." Asked whether Reform would be better, he said, "I don't know. I thought I'd give them a try."

I think we can all agree that these are well thought out political views, from an intelligent and informed demographic.

Universal suffrage.

Mark Drakeford was highly regarded by most during the pandemic in Wales.

 

[BoldonLad]

I selected him as an extreme top end example of a pro footballer, not the average.
Also, he ultimately made more money from investing in property than he did from football so, meh.

Well, I knew he wasn't a pauper 😊

My point was, quoting income figures from 50+ years ago is meaningless, without the context of the time.

At around the same era (early 1970s) I met and sold some stuff to two "professional" footballers from the Sunderland Cup winning team of 1973. Compared to everyone else I knew at the time, they were fairly affluent, not so much so by today's standards.

 

[BoldonLad]

Are British muslims less entitled than British christians, or British jews or British atheists to vote based on foreign policy?

If we are talking local council elections, to me, voting based on Foreign Policy seems a bit pointless.

 

[Pblakeney]

Well, I knew he wasn't a pauper 😊

My point was, quoting income figures from 50+ years ago is meaningless, without the context of the time.

At around the same era (early 1970s) I met and sold some stuff to two "professional" footballers from the Sunderland Cup winning team of 1973. Compared to everyone else I knew at the time, they were fairly affluent, not so much so by today's standards.

Well, my point was replying to a reference of footballers buying houses in a specific area 50 years ago.
There were very few full time professional footballers in the mid-70s. That was the context. Yes, things have changed.

 

[Shortfall]

Are British muslims less entitled than British christians, or British jews or British atheists to vote based on foreign policy?

There's a lot of the usual stuff on here at the moment blaming the voters for the state of the country coupled with an unhealthy amount of sneering at the "racist thickos" who voted Reform. PBlakeney was critical of people who he thought were using the local elections as a protest about immigration and the point of my post was to suggest that it isn't just the people who he obviously disapproves of that use local elections to protest about national issues. But you knew that.

 

[BoldonLad]

Is Ponteland Newcastle or Northumberland? My aunt lived in Darras Hall in the seventies, none of the neighbours were footballers then.

Ponteland would appear to have it's own Town Council https://www.ponteland-tc.gov.uk

It is a relatively affluent area, but, I am sure, as with most places in the former Industrial Area in and around Tyneside, there will be "poor" areas, within walking distance.

 

[Pblakeney]

There's a lot of the usual stuff on here at the moment blaming the voters for the state of the country coupled with an unhealthy amount of sneering at the "racist thickos" who voted Reform. PBlakeney was critical of people who he thought were using the local elections as a protest about immigration and the point of my post was to suggest that it isn't just the people who he obviously disapproves of that use local elections to protest about national issues. But you knew that.

I think anyone voting in local council elections based on national issues is doing a stupid action. But that is just my opinion.
Clear enough?

 

[Shortfall]

I think anyone voting in local council elections based on national issues is doing a stupid action. But that is just my opinion.
Clear enough?

Yup.

 

[BoldonLad]

BBC reporting that Starmer has appointed Gordon Brown and Harriet Harman as advisors https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c1428pev1n0t

Gordon might be useful when the next Financial Crash comes, at least he has seen one before.

 

[briantrumpet]

BBC reporting that Starmer has appointed Gordon Brown and Harriet Harman as advisors https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c1428pev1n0t

Gordon might be useful when the next Financial Crash comes, at least he has seen one before.

Well, it's probably a safer appointment than Mandelson.

 

[Pross]

As Rusty states, a large number of people use the local elections to send a message to Westminster.
They (and most on here) didn't want the Tories and still don't.
Labour got in, and they don't like Labour either now after all the U-turns and the botched efforts to achieve growth.

So what are the traditional parties going to do to regain the trust of the electorate?
That's the question and topic you should be discussing.
Not resorting to the usual Reform voters are thick trope, and Reform councils will be crap.

There was a Tory representative on Radio 5 earlier and, after an unpromising start where she said Kemi was improving despite their own election results begging to differ, showed rare signs of common sense in a politician from the former ‘big 2’ parties. When asked how the Tories get their votes back she said the same as many on here, stop trying to be Reform Light and work on your own policies. I think the same applies with Labour too, it’s pointless trying to emulate someone else’s populist policies unless you’re prepared to go further than them. Concentrate on sensible, centrist policies as that’s where General Elections have traditionally been won.

Labour are being particularly dim as they have already had the benefit of seeing what happened to the Tories when they tried to compete with Reform at their own game but for whatever reason have done exactly the same. Farage is a complete daffodil but has been extremely clever at getting the direction of political travel in his favour despite having never been close to power at national level. This is then driving those who are desperate to avoid Reform gaining power to also rethink their vote.

Ultimately I think we’re going to end up with coalition politics in the future which I feel is a good thing, the big question is whether it will take a Reform government before we get there and whether there is a split in Labour and the Tories. I’d like to see a return of a centre right Tory party and for the Lib Dem’s to somehow get heard above the noise of Reform and the Greens.

 

[BoldonLad]

Well, it's probably a safer appointment than Mandelson.

I note you only said "probably" 😂

 

[Pross]

Universal suffrage.

Mark Drakeford was highly regarded by most during the pandemic in Wales.

Not to mention they didn’t decide to punish Labour in the Senedd election immediately after the pandemic (when I think there were still quite a few restrictions in place). Consensus at the time was Wales (and Scotland) were handling things better than Westminster on the bits they could control.

 

[Pblakeney]

Ultimately I think we’re going to end up with coalition politics in the future which I feel is a good thing, the big question is whether it will take a Reform government before we get there and whether there is a split in Labour and the Tories. I’d like to see a return of a centre right Tory party and for the Lib Dem’s to somehow get heard above the noise of Reform and the Greens.

I fear that it is inevitable.
The follow on question is how bad will things be when we get the coalition? And will it be solvable?

Spoiler

I think the nation's economy is already down the drain and past the point of no return. "Fixing" the country will be very, very expensive if it is to happen. For everyone.