Starmer's vision quest

[Deleted member 49]

You keep on running headfirst into that high brick wall, Adam.

There are a load of Tory toffs sitting looking over the top of it at you, quaffing champagne and laughing.

As well as tits like you...enjoy it whilst it lasts.

 

[winjim]

Is a Murdoch-approved “Labour” government the limit of our ambition now, or even what we need?

Yes to the first, no to the second. What we need IMO is a complete restructuring of our society, economically, politically, constitutionally and socially. That's unlikely to happen within the next eighteen months though. For now I can't imagine a scenario where any Labour government can be as bad as these Tories and the priority absolutely has to be getting rid of these ghouls we have in power.

That's not an endorsement of any other party but a recognition that the one we have in charge right now is so egregiously awful that getting them out pretty much trumps any other consideration. It's a sorry state of affairs but for now it's realistically the best we can hope to manage.

What I'd like to see, and what I think should be achieveable is replacement of our current voting system with a form of PR. That would be a small step in the right direction. I'd also like to see more oversight of appointments to the House of Lords although that's a bit more contentious as I don't necessarily favour a directly elected second chamber.

 

[multitool]

Some of life’s more interesting questions are difficult ones.

Murdoch’s Starmer’s Labour are currently twenty points ahead and predicted to gain an unhealthy 160 seat majority.

I understand that things might change over the next eighteen months, Tufton Street will do their best to pump more sewage into the discourse, and the electorate can be fickle. Despite that I would prefer Labour to risk a few votes and constituencies by being just a tiny bit more like a socialist party. You know, supporting workers, the less privileged, putting essential monopolies under public ownership and control ”for the many, not the few.”

The choice is not binary. There is plenty of territory between Red Tory and Castro that would still assure a comfortable and worthwhile Labour victory.

I would like a country with a GINI coefficient of zero, prison sentences for political corruption and lying in parliament, the dismantling of the non-dom owned media hegemony, the abolition of public schools, a functioning and free NHS, and the abolition of the monarchy.

Clearly, I'm going to be disappointed in all of those ambitions.

The one slight possibility is that we get an election result that smashes the Conservative Party to pieces for a decade. I'll take that.

 

[newfhouse]

Yes to the first, no to the second. What we need IMO is a complete restructuring of our society, economically, politically, constitutionally and socially. That's unlikely to happen within the next eighteen months though. For now I can't imagine a scenario where any Labour government can be as bad as these Tories and the priority absolutely has to be getting rid of these ghouls we have in power.

That's not an endorsement of any other party but a recognition that the one we have in charge right now is so egregiously awful that getting them out pretty much trumps any other consideration. It's a sorry state of affairs but for now it's realistically the best we can hope to manage.

I will give my usually worthless vote to whoever has the best chance of ejecting the local Tory but as I said above I’d prefer Starmer‘s Labour to actually believe in the meaningful changes we both want and need. It’s not the size of the majority that counts, it’s what you do with it.

 

[Deleted member 49]

I would like a country with a GINI coefficient of zero, prison sentences for political corruption and lying in parliament, the dismantling of the non-dom owned media hegemony, the abolition of public schools, a functioning and free NHS, and the abolition of the monarchy.

Clearly, I'm going to be disappointed in all of those ambitions.

The one slight possibility is that we get an election result that smashes the Conservative Party to pieces for a decade. I'll take that.

That's the fecking bubble you live in...you don't think there's money to change things ? There's allways money,Covid should have shown you that.Its just top heavy,nobody near the bottom is getting any.In the current climate and the state the country is in its p1ss poor from Starmer.Allready unaffordable bills....don't worry we'll freeze them ffs.
Meanwhile....

View: https://twitter.com/FD/status/1641730456604295169?t=8a0i6hQ3QNKpvAjEAtVflw&s=19

 

[multitool]

That's the fecking bubble you live in...you don't think there's money to change things ? There's allways money,Covid should have shown you that.Its just top heavy,nobody near the bottom is getting any.In the current climate and the state the country is in its p1ss poor from Starmer.Allready unaffordable bills....don't worry we'll freeze them ffs.
Meanwhile....

View: https://twitter.com/FD/status/1641730456604295169?t=8a0i6hQ3QNKpvAjEAtVflw&s=19

Have a look at what I said about the GINI index, the monarchy and private schools, Adam.

 

[multitool]

As well as tits like you...enjoy it whilst it lasts.

It's prícks like you that delivered another Tory majority.

Well done. Very clever 👏

 

[Deleted member 49]

Have a look at what I said about the GINI index, the monarchy and private schools, Adam.

The Monarchy and private schooling aren't the first problems many in this country are arsed about.Id like rid of them but I can wait a while for that.
Inequality he has no idea of,he has no vision to even try and change it.Everythings going up in price Energy bills,Council Tax etc etc and he won't even support striking workers,whats Labours min wage policy ? something like a tenner a hour,more than likely below the Tories.
Every single fecking thing there saying is we won't make things worse, we'll keep it as it is now.Zero ambition they don't deserve my vote.

 

[multitool]

The Monarchy and private schooling aren't the first problems many in this country are arsed about.Id like rid of them but I can wait a while for that.
Inequality he has no idea of,he has no vision to even try and change it.Everythings going up in price Energy bills,Council Tax etc etc and he won't even support striking workers,whats Labours min wage policy ? something like a tenner a hour,more than likely below the Tories.
Every single fecking thing there saying is we won't make things worse, we'll keep it as it is now.Zero ambition they don't deserve my vote.

You have no answers to anything Adam. In fact your entire approach to this discussion is to bypass your brain entirely. It's like you learned absolutely nothing from 2019 and want exactly the same approach again, with a result that you will then bitch about incessantly, and doubtless prescribe exactly the same approach again as the solution.

Like an idiot running headfirst into a wall, repeatedly, because he hasn't noticed the door on one side.

Thump.

 

[winjim]

I will give my usually worthless vote to whoever has the best chance of ejecting the local Tory but as I said above I’d prefer Starmer‘s Labour to actually believe in the meaningful changes we both want and need. It’s not the size of the majority that counts, it’s what you do with it.

Indeed, also I'm aware that I'm possibly not his target audience since I'll never vote Tory, although I'm not habitually a Labour voter either.

 

[multitool]

Indeed, also I'm aware that I'm possibly not his target audience since I'll never vote Tory, although I'm not habitually a Labour voter either.

I'd vote Lib Dem if the realistic choice was between a Lib Dem MP or a Tory. I'd vote near enough anything to the left of the Tories if it denied them a seat in the HoC.

I can't see what other choice there is.

 

[fozy tornip]

I will give my usually worthless vote to whoever has the best chance of ejecting the local Tory but as I said above I’d prefer Starmer‘s Labour to actually believe in the meaningful changes we both want and need. It’s not the size of the majority that counts, it’s what you do with it.

As I think I said at the Blackpool conference:

Naturally it's fab to see the Conservatives imploding under the weight of their own filth, and a change of government is fervently to be wished, but without radical rejuvenation of our democracy it feels like the offer of respite care merely.
Yes it will be nice to spend a few days in a cosy B&B in Staithes courtesy the local churches' Carer Support initiative, strolling the foreshore, unwinding, drinking slow fireside pints in a smugglers' pub, catching up with a bit of reading, getting some uninterrupted nights' sleep. But it'll pass all too quickly and then back to your alzheimic charge, to the nerve-shredding howling, the violence, the incontinence and gibberish, to the accelerating tragedy.
The party of the non-dom tax avoider will re-group. Although I'm getting on a bit and there's talk of them being out of power for a generation, I fear I could yet live to see it.

 

[Deleted member 49]

You have no answers to anything Adam. In fact your entire approach to this discussion is to bypass your brain entirely. It's like you learned absolutely nothing from 2019 and want exactly the same approach again, with a result that you will then bitch about incessantly, and doubtless prescribe exactly the same approach again as the solution.

Like an idiot running headfirst into a wall, repeatedly, because he hasn't noticed the door on one side.

It's odd that isn't it because it seems like the only thing I ever read on hear is "it's better than a Tory government" Not really a glowing endorsement for voting Labour is it.

 

[Deleted member 49]

I'd vote Lib Dem if the realistic choice was between a Lib Dem MP or a Tory. I'd vote near enough anything to the left of the Tories if it denied them a seat in the HoC.

I can't see what other choice there is.

You answered for me....feck all about anything except "not the Tories"
Look where voting Lib Dem got us in the past.

 

[Deleted member 49]

What the feck does this mean...there not in power.My council tax is already 2 grand this year.

View: https://twitter.com/Keir_Starmer/status/1642427584653697025?t=dscQw_ztc6Vy-zO4ia2o_g&s=19