Starmer's vision quest

[icowden]

Well my chances of voting Labour have gone from slim to non existent.

Do you live in an area where Labour can win?
If not, why vote for them anyway?
If so, then do you really want the current shootshow to continue?

 

[winjim]

Do you live in an area where Labour can win?
If not, why vote for them anyway?
If so, then do you really want the current shootshow to continue?

I do live in an area where Labour can win. I consider Labour to be a sh*tshow although I also consider a Labour government to be an inevitability.

 

[winjim]

Oh yeah, Labour came to my door and we had a lovely conversation about how I was sick of having a de facto two party system, how I wanted more diversity of opinion in parliament, more representation from smaller parties, PR etc. Then she told me if I didn't vote for Labour I would be enabling the Tories. So they can f*ck right off.

 

[icowden]

Oh yeah, Labour came to my door and we had a lovely conversation about how I was sick of having a de facto two party system, how I wanted more diversity of opinion in parliament, more representation from smaller parties, PR etc. Then she told me if I didn't vote for Labour I would be enabling the Tories. So they can f*ck right off.

You have a difficulty with the binary truth then. For your area you are either supporting the Conservative candidate or the Labour one. That's it. Anything else and you might as well not have voted.

 

[winjim]

You have a difficulty with the binary truth then. For your area you are either supporting the Conservative candidate or the Labour one. That's it. Anything else and you might as well not have voted.

Where is it you think I live? And why do people seem to assume that I necessarily vote for the party I want to form the next government, or the person I think will win the seat? I literally had a conversation with the woman about this subject and she still made that mistake.

 

[Mr Celine]

Saw Starmer described as 'a balloon on a stick with a face drawn on it' which is accurate. I look at him in the same way I look at expanded polystyrene.

I think you're being a bit harsh.


Expanded polystyrene has many obvious qualities.

 

[winjim]

I think you're being a bit harsh.


Expanded polystyrene has many obvious qualities.

Mostly filler.

 

[C R]

Oh yeah, Labour came to my door and we had a lovely conversation about how I was sick of having a de facto two party system, how I wanted more diversity of opinion in parliament, more representation from smaller parties, PR etc. Then she told me if I didn't vote for Labour I would be enabling the Tories. So they can f*ck right off.

I would have said that we get tory policy with Starmer anyway, so what's the difference.

 

[winjim]

I would have said that we get tory policy with Starmer anyway, so what's the difference.

I'm not one of those people who thinks that Starmer is literally a Tory and I do think that the government he inevitably leads will be better than this one. But that's because it can't possibly be even worse. The bar is set so low it may as well be in one of those HS2 tunnels.

 

[albion]

I do live in an area where Labour can win. I consider Labour to be a sh*tshow although I also consider a Labour government to be an inevitability.

Exactly why we got our current government. With fptp we have little choice but to grin and bear it.

 

[winjim]

Exactly why we got our current government. With fptp we have little choice but to grin and bear it.

I mentioned this to the Labour doorstep lady. She blamed the unions.

 

[albion]

Having just listened to lawyer theatrics from Geoffrey Cox I do wonder how such OTT twaddle gets received by the masses.
The BBC is certainly running with the anti labour agenda that has only vague truth. The farce had much opportunism about it.

 

[icowden]

Where is it you think I live? And why do people seem to assume that I necessarily vote for the party I want to form the next government, or the person I think will win the seat?

Because anything else is essentially a waste of your time under the current system. You can vote for the monster raving loonies, but it won't make a difference to anything. You have the power to choose the next government but with the current system that's only a choice between 2 candidates in almost all areas.

In my area it's a choice between Lib Dem or Tory. If you vote anything but Lib Dem you are essentially backing the Tory candidate. I don't like the system, but it's what we have. Very few areas have more than a 2 way split.

My perfect result at the moment would be a Labour Lib Dem coalition. Cross-party politics makes much better policies as it tempers the extreme ends of Politics.

 

[Deleted member 121]

Because anything else is essentially a waste of your time under the current system. You can vote for the monster raving loonies, but it won't make a difference to anything. You have the power to choose the next government but with the current system that's only a choice between 2 candidates in almost all areas.

Have you not considered that that is the reason why we have effectively a two party state? Why nothing changes? Its cowardly and lacks a certain self respect which the majority lack admittedly and who's will can be bent and sold cheaply for people they seldom believe in.

In my area it's a choice between Lib Dem or Tory. If you vote anything but Lib Dem you are essentially backing the Tory candidate. I don't like the system, but it's what we have. Very few areas have more than a 2 way split.

If most think like you then that is what you deserve and will get... You don't like the system, but are playing the game anyway and are likely happy to blame others for the privilege.

My perfect result at the moment would be a Labour Lib Dem coalition. Cross-party politics makes much better policies as it tempers the extreme ends of Politics.

Why? The last coalition led to Brexit and a collapse of the Lib Dem's and an austerity which will take generations to recover from to any certain degree. What was it that was tempered and what policies did you enjoy from the Cameron-Clegg era?

 

[multitool]

'The system' is what we have, and unless there is an effective campaign to change it, change won't happen. Its a system that delivers opposition in parliament rather than co-operation.

It works exceptionally well if the incumbent party is good, and exceptionally badly if it isn't.