Starmer's vision quest

[icowden]

I don't even want to imagine how awful it will be with either Rayner or Phillips as Prime Minister but we're probably going to find out quite soon.

Why do you think it would be awful if Rayner of Philips were to become Prime Minister?

Both of them are honest, strong, principled, outspoken women who have worked hard to reach their position without the benefit of Public School education or wealthy parents. Both of them understand the Labour Party. Rayner is more likely to pull the party significantly to the left - I'd prefer Philips to be in charge over Rayner.

What makes you think a fundamentally dishonest old Etonian that hasn't had to work for a day in his life would be better? We have been trying those out for some time and I'll be honest. It's not gone as well as you might have thought.

 

[briantrumpet]

At the moment, it's clear that the main opposition to Starmer is within his own party (see the likely watering down on disability benefits). Badenoch scored an own goal by trying to tag on all sorts of other demands in return for supporting it.

It was true of Johnson, and it's equally true of Starmer: a party with a big majority and no effective opposition won't be a good government, because they think they can do what they will, regardless of the rigour/strength of their proposals. Starmer is making policy decisions predicated on hard financial choices and chasing the pollsters (under guidance from Morgan McSweeney), and that's not a recipe for good government.

 

[Psamathe]

.

I don't even want to imagine how awful it will be with either Rayner or Phillips as Prime Minister but we're probably going to find out quite soon.

Why do you think it would be awful if Rayner of Philips were to become Prime Minister?

Although I didn't post the comment and also don't want the Conservatives back in my worst nightmares, I don't think Phillips would be in any running.

The big big problem with Rayner is that she is totally driven by lobbyists and business. Discards even trivial prior commitments because of lobbying/vested interests.

Ian

 

[Pross]

At the moment, it's clear that the main opposition to Starmer is within his own party (see the likely watering down on disability benefits). Badenoch scored an own goal by trying to tag on all sorts of other demands in return for supporting it.

It was true of Johnson, and it's equally true of Starmer: a party with a big majority and no effective opposition won't be a good government, because they think they can do what they will, regardless of the rigour/strength of their proposals. Starmer is making policy decisions predicated on hard financial choices and chasing the pollsters (under guidance from Morgan McSweeney), and that's not a recipe for good government.

I did find whichever Shadow Minister it was doing the rounds this morning, with their demands in order to support the Government, quite amusing. It was almost like they felt they are still relevant in UK politics, they also continue to talk like they weren't in charge for over a decade and failed to address all these things they have now decided are problems. They may officially be the opposition but it's plain that Labour see Reform as their big threat in the same way the Tories saw UKIP as their main threat back in 2015.

 

[Shortfall]

Why do you think it would be awful if Rayner of Philips were to become Prime Minister?

Both of them are honest, strong, principled, outspoken women who have worked hard to reach their position without the benefit of Public School education or wealthy parents. Both of them understand the Labour Party. Rayner is more likely to pull the party significantly to the left - I'd prefer Philips to be in charge over Rayner.

What makes you think a fundamentally dishonest old Etonian that hasn't had to work for a day in his life would be better? We have been trying those out for some time and I'll be honest. It's not gone as well as you might have thought.

I'll give Rayner her props for getting to where she is from humble beginnings, but do I think she's fit to be governing the country? Not for a minute. The probability of this government getting consumed by a sovereign debt crisis before the next election is quite high and I don't think there are any grown ups in the cabinet who are equipped to deal with that. Let's see what the future brings. One of us will be right.

 

[Pross]

Why do you think it would be awful if Rayner of Philips were to become Prime Minister?

Both of them are honest, strong, principled, outspoken women who have worked hard to reach their position without the benefit of Public School education or wealthy parents. Both of them understand the Labour Party. Rayner is more likely to pull the party significantly to the left - I'd prefer Philips to be in charge over Rayner.

What makes you think a fundamentally dishonest old Etonian that hasn't had to work for a day in his life would be better? We have been trying those out for some time and I'll be honest. It's not gone as well as you might have thought.

I admire Rayner but feel she would be very devisive and too left-wing for me. Philips is probably the MP I most respect in any Party. I've said many times I want politicians to have convinction (as opposed to convinctions which seems far more common these days!) even if I fundementally disagree with them. Let the voters decide if their policies are the ones the majority want and, if so, they should push through with them. All this u-turning, backtracking etc. trying to keep a different subset of voters happy just means nothing gets done. It feels like our Governments have done very little productive work since 2015 at least.

 

[briantrumpet]

I did find whichever Shadow Minister it was doing the rounds this morning, with their demands in order to support the Government, quite amusing. It was almost like they felt they are still relevant in UK politics, they also continue to talk like they weren't in charge for over a decade and failed to address all these things they have now decided are problems. They may officially be the opposition but it's plain that Labour see Reform as their big threat in the same way the Tories saw UKIP as their main threat back in 2015.

He's as slippery as a slippery thing, but Farage is just much better at populist politics than Badenoch and the rump of the Tory Party that's left. Tories now have no intellectual underpinning or talent amongst the MPs. Any vaguely competent/believable ones gave up under Johnson.

 

[Pblakeney]

The probability of this government getting consumed by a sovereign debt crisis before the next election is quite high and I don't think there are any grown ups in Westminster who are equipped to deal with that.

I agree, but only mostly. Edited to reflect my opinion.

 

[icowden]

I'll give Rayner her props for getting to where she is from humble beginnings, but do I think she's fit to be governing the country? Not for a minute. The probability of this government getting consumed by a sovereign debt crisis before the next election is quite high and I don't think there are any grown ups in the cabinet who are equipped to deal with that. Let's see what the future brings. One of us will be right.

She's at least had experience of debt and poverty...

 

[Pross]

It's amazing how short people's memories are. This time last year we were living with what a Sunak 'led' Tory government was actually like and yet we now have people trying to claim that a Sunak led Government would have been better and predicting how bad a Labour Government will make things. Sovreign debt crisis? I know Truss was now nearly 3 whole years ago but have people really forgotten what she 'achieved' in a few weeks of her reign of terror? I'm beginning to think the conspiracy theorists that talk about mind-control chemicals in aircraft contrails may actually be onto something. With the limited choices on offer I'm still happy that the choice to try something new rather than sticking what I already had evidence would fvck things up was the right decision.

 

[First Aspect]

It's amazing how short people's memories are. This time last year we were living with what a Sunak 'led' Tory government was actually like and yet we now have people trying to claim that a Sunak led Government would have been and predicting how bad a Labour Government will make things. Sovreign debt crisis? I know Truss was now nearly 3 whole years ago but have people really forgotten what she 'achieved' in a few weeks of her reign of terror? I'm beginning to think the conspiracy theorists that talk about mind-control chemicals in aircraft contrails may actually be onto something. With the limited choices on offer I'm still happy that the choice to try something new rather than sticking what I already had evidence would fvck things up was the right decision.

Contrails are called that because con is short for "control". Didn't you know?

 

[briantrumpet]

It's amazing how short people's memories are. This time last year we were living with what a Sunak 'led' Tory government was actually like and yet we now have people trying to claim that a Sunak led Government would have been better and predicting how bad a Labour Government will make things. Sovreign debt crisis? I know Truss was now nearly 3 whole years ago but have people really forgotten what she 'achieved' in a few weeks of her reign of terror? I'm beginning to think the conspiracy theorists that talk about mind-control chemicals in aircraft contrails may actually be onto something. With the limited choices on offer I'm still happy that the choice to try something new rather than sticking what I already had evidence would fvck things up was the right decision.

People who fail rely on very short memory spans so that they can rewrite history. I went from hoping that Sunak might restore a bit of competence to Government to realising he had ended up as hopelessly out of his depth as Johnson: hope evaporated as fast as the rain poured down on his departure speech. It was so funny as it was the perfect metaphor: he couldn't even organise an umbrella.

 

[CXRAndy]

Truss was now nearly 3 whole years ago but have people really forgotten what she 'achieved' in a few weeks of her reign of terror?

Now the dust has settled, this is the considered opinion as to what happened and why

The BoE bears partial responsibility for the bond spike due to its failure to regulate LDI funds adequately and its poorly timed monetary policy decisions, which primed the market for instability. However, Truss’s mini-budget was a significant catalyst, as its unfunded tax cuts and lack of fiscal credibility triggered the immediate market reaction. The crisis was a confluence of government missteps and central bank oversights, with neither fully absolved.

 

[CXRAndy]

"He's no longer really the prime minister. He's just some bloke who lives in Downing Street!"

 

[midlandsgrimpeur]

Why do you think it would be awful if Rayner of Philips were to become Prime Minister?

Both of them are honest, strong, principled, outspoken women who have worked hard to reach their position without the benefit of Public School education or wealthy parents. Both of them understand the Labour Party. Rayner is more likely to pull the party significantly to the left - I'd prefer Philips to be in charge over Rayner.

What makes you think a fundamentally dishonest old Etonian that hasn't had to work for a day in his life would be better? We have been trying those out for some time and I'll be honest. It's not gone as well as you might have thought.

Interestingly, Lewis Goodall on a recent Newsagents podcast said that the clear consensus within Labour (MP's and party members) was that Rayner is the clear choice as a potential successor to Starmer in future.