Nurse murdered seven babies

[fozy tornip]

Is 'raising a Datix' related to 'pushing up daisies'?

 

[Cirrus]

Is 'raising a Datix' related to 'pushing up daisies'?

No, but pushing up daisies could be the consequence of not listening to concerns, a la seven murdered infants.

 

[fozy tornip]

What is it then, I'm sort of asking?

 

[Cirrus]

What is it then, I'm sort of asking?

Risk management process/system for patient safety, Google is your friend

 

[Bromptonaut]

What is it then, I'm sort of asking?

A quick shufty on Google gives this:

https://www.med.scot.nhs.uk/trainee-doctors/learning-from-datixes/what-happens-when-i-submit-a-datix

That particular example is in Scotland but I doubt it differs in more than the odd detail from England.

 

[fozy tornip]

Google is your friend

Unpacking obscure acronyms the first time you use them in a text is friendlier.

 

[Cirrus]

Unpacking obscure acronyms the first time you use them in a text is friendlier.

Hmmm.. friendly, here? You lead and I will follow.

 

[fozy tornip]

Alright, Google it is.

 

[Beebo]

There will lots of handwringing but hindsight is a wonderful thing.

In reality no one in the NHS had the time or resources to investigate this matter in the detail necessary to prove guilt.

Dr Jane Hawdon did a brief review of each baby's medical notes but she told the trust she did not have the time to conduct a thorough investigation. Remember the trail took 9 months. No one could possibly dedicate that sort of time to an internal investigation.

These types of incidents are so rare that there is very little that can be done when the evidence is purely circumstantial.

 

[Pale Rider]

Nothing I would suspect, other than the fear of “reprisals” from management. Makes you wonder for whose benefit the NHS is run, doesn’t it? I think patients are way down the list.

That's what the consultants are saying, but it comes as a surprise to me.

Consultants tend to be a law unto themselves, often outspoken, and certainly not likely to cower on receipt of a snotty email from a management which enjoys no respect.

I suppose at this stage of the process, everyone who was anywhere near Letby is trying to make their own ends right.

 

[C R]

That's what the consultants are saying, but it comes as a surprise to me.

Consultants tend to be a law unto themselves, often outspoken, and certainly not likely to cower on receipt of a snotty email from a management which enjoys no respect.

I suppose at this stage of the process, everyone who was anywhere near Letby is trying to make their own ends right.

There's however, the fact that some consultants were forced to write a letter of apology to her for not wanting her back in the ward. This was before her arrest, so clearly the disquiet must have been expressed quite forcefully, to require a formal apology. And the management must have been sufficiently happy with her returning to force the apology to happen.

There's also something strange I read. Apparently her father was involved in getting her reinstated and to get the letter of apology. It is not clear to me in what capacity Letby's father could have been involved.

 

[Pale Rider]

There's however, the fact that some consultants were forced to write a letter of apology to her for not wanting her back in the ward.

I also found that unlikely in that I suspect a couple of consultants of my acquaint in the same position would have told management to 'kiss my ass' rather than write a letter they didn't mean.

There's also something strange I read. Apparently her father was involved in getting her reinstated and to get the letter of apology. It is not clear to me in what capacity Letby's father could have been involved.

Agreed, that does seem odd.

I'm guessing the Letby waters will get a lot murkier before, if ever, they clear.

 

[C R]

also found that unlikely in that I suspect a couple of consultants of my acquaint in the same position would have told management to 'kiss my ass' rather than write a letter they didn't mean.

But there's no dispute that the letter was written, which would back the consultants' version of events.

 

[BoldonLad]

Was doing some work with a Trust a year or so ago and the management was appalling. I flagged several issues to them around patient/practitioner risk . All they were interested in was covering their arses.

I was quite concerned so raised a Datix, it got some wheels in motion but they were still ass covering when I moved on.

Yes, in my working life, (some time ago now) I worked for several NHS Trusts, not impressive.

 

[presta]

It's just selection bias, what about all the babies that weren't killed and all the nurses that didn't murder.

having ignored and even tried to shut down complaints

Are you surprised by that?

we need to employ managers with enough nous to manage a difficult situation

They do.
The NHS has to be protected, litigation costs them a fortune, and besides, people don't want the bad publicity.

When we believe a certain group are beyond suspicion, and therefore scrutiny, its only a matter of time before the "baddies" are drawn to that profession or occupation

You don't say.

True, one would suspect that, no matter what the evidence, the jury members would find it very difficult to believe that a nurse could do such things.

A society that doesn't want to listen when people try to draw attention to what goes on in the NHS can't really complain when it escalates to the point of murder.

The closest comparison I can think of is the Shipman case, where again nobody wanted to think the unthinkable

Everyone knew his patients were dropping like flies, that's why they called him Dr Death, and yet his patients were so outraged by the suggestion he was a killer they bounced the police out of the house for suggesting it. It's interesting just how far a good bedside manner and a few Christmas presents will get you.

What would have prevented the consultants now claiming to have had their concerns mis-handled by hospital management, going direct to the police themselves?

Their careers of course, blow the whistle and that's your career down the drain.
All the thanks Steven Bolsin got for blowing the whistle on the Bristol baby scandal was to make himself unemployable in the UK, he had to emigrate to Australia to find work. The NHS spent £10 million trying to destroy Raj Mattu.

There will lots of handwringing but hindsight is a wonderful thing.

It isn't hindsight though, is it.

There's one NHS scandal after another after another, and the story plays out the same way every time. Another inquiry, the same old conclusions, the same platitudes, and then the report getting stuffed down the back of the filing cabinet whist they carry on with business as usual. As Roy Lilley said on Channel 4 News: "I could write the report now".

The complaint system is corrupt to the core, so if there's to be any change at all it'll have to come from the public, and as long as they stand on their doorsteps clapping and telling them what heroes they are, attacking anyone else who does otherwise, the NHS will have no reason to change whatsoever.