Oh no!! Brexit not going quite as well as hoped

[BoldonLad]

And doing all that 'preparedness' to then have it all undermined by cheap imports under WTO , or US trade deals, why would they do that ??

Farming is a long term business

With unstable, and unpredictable markets, uncertain income, no knowledge of what is happening long term, why would they do that

Very few farmers or producers were ever making big money .

The commodity price is pegged to what the buyers know is the cost of production, it's a buyer's market in perishables .

Many farmers were getting just over the cost of production , not always that .

Also buyers know how much single farm payment farmers were getting.

Many farmers were / are living on that, and credit

Many are going bankrupt .

Having invested in modern high tech equipment, only to see the supply chain , including seasonal labour supply swept away.



Some landowners are fabulously rich, but not as a result of producing food.

The same, or similar, could be said for several Industries, either now or in the past. Remember when we had a Ship Building Industry, for example, or, a significant Motor Industry, or indeed almost any heavy industry you care to mention.

 

[stowie]

I understand the problem of planning for the unknown, or, constantly shifting target, but........

there can be no excuse for not planning for staff levels, free movement of people was never on the table, indeed, ending free of people was a key objective of most "leavers" as far as I can see.

To be clear, I am not excusing Government, merely saying that they are (sadly) not the only incompetents in the arena.

From what I saw, a lot of preparation was being done with the expectation that May's deal would be implemented. Then she goes out and Johnson comes in with a bunch of contradictory claims to Brexit and very little in the way of any detail.

It wasn't 5 years to prepare. It was 4 years to prepare for the wrong implementation and then a year of flailing around second guessing as Boris SpOke hIs BraInes.

Stuff like staffing and expectation of visa requirements was done in my experience. For example, at least one company moved back end European functions from the UK to the EU in expectation that visa requirements for foreign nationals would make recruiting more difficult in the UK. Stuff like supply chain implementation was chaotic as the potential Brexit outcomes were so diverse right up until the wire.

 

[mudsticks]

The same, or similar, could be said for several Industries, either now or in the past. Remember when we had a Ship Building Industry, for example, or, a significant Motor Industry, or indeed almost any heavy industry you care to mention.

Indeed, they could have been supported better too.

Encouraged to move into greener outputs perhaps.

But would you agree that farming and food, the stuff we all need to stay alive , everyday, is a particularly vital sector to think about the long term security and stability of ??

Or should we just rely on cheap imports , and hope that supply doesn't dry up??

 

[BoldonLad]

Indeed, they could have been supported better too.

Encouraged to move into greener outputs perhaps.

But would you agree that farming and food, the stuff we all need to stay alive , everyday, is a particularly vital sector to think about the long term security and stability of ??

Or should we just rely on cheap imports , and hope that supply doesn't dry up??

Yes, I would agree that Food Production is strategic.

However, I do not see "home production" and Imports as mutually exclusive.

Protectionism is seldom a good thing, in the long term, regardless of Industry.

 

[Deleted member 49]

Priti Patel at the conference.... "And that's not all. We have finally ended free movement."
Applause from the Tories FFS.
She fecking sickens me.

 

[Cirrus]

Well credit where credit is due, according to JRM anyway... Rees-Mogg: Corbyn to thank for enabling Brexit [Video] (aol.co.uk)

 

[mudsticks]

Yes, I would agree that Food Production is strategic.

However, I do not see "home production" and Imports as mutually exclusive.

Protectionism is seldom a good thing, in the long term, regardless of Industry.

The Common Agricultural Policy was / is protectionism'.

It supports farmers doing better than average farming , supports food security in Europe.

Not perfect, and under reform .

We as farmers and consumers are now outside of that.

It means it's harder for our farmers to make a living exporting into EU produce from here that was in demand there.

I agree inter country trade is not a bad thing

But our present food system is highly insecure, post brexit, whether for home grown, or imported products.

Nearly all countries have some kind of protectionism system of tariffs on food imports.

With our zero to not very much, negotiating power with countries like the US , over 'trade deals' if they ever happen, we won't be able to shield our farmers here doing 'the right thing' by environment and workers.

From lower standard imported goods.

I don't think that's ok for long term food security , or food quality in this country.

 

[BoldonLad]

The Common Agricultural Policy was / is protectionism'.

It supports farmers doing better than average farming , supports food security in Europe.

Not perfect, and under reform .

We as farmers and consumers are now outside of that.

It means it's harder for our farmers to make a living exporting into EU produce from here that was in demand there.

I agree inter country trade is not a bad thing

But our present food system is highly insecure, post brexit, whether for home grown, or imported products.

Nearly all countries have some kind of protectionism system of tariffs on food imports.

With our zero to not very much, negotiating power with countries like the US , over 'trade deals' if they ever happen, we won't be able to shield our farmers here doing 'the right thing' by environment and workers.

From lower standard imported goods.

I don't think that's ok for long term food security , or food quality in this country.

All I can say is "I voted remain, a pity a few more didn't"

 

[mudsticks]

All I can say is "I voted remain, a pity a few more didn't"

I know you did, I'm not holding you responsible for the leave vote.

All I'm saying is that it's unreasonable to opine that farmers should have somehow 'prepared' better.

They didn't, and still don't even know what they're supposed to be 'preparing' for.

So shifting responsibility on to them, is unfair.

It takes responsibility away from those who should be taking it.

 

[Archie_tect]

All I can say is "I voted remain, a pity a few more didn't"

If just 700,000 of the 'don't knows' had decided on the day to vote to remain rather than to vote to leave, we wouldn't be where we are. Shows just how tragic this whole mess is.

At least Farage is now a complete 'has been'.... that's it... that's the Brexit benefit!

 

[Milkfloat]

@BoldonLad You keep stating that we had 5 years to prepare and you keep being told that no we did not, nobody had a clue what the deal was going to be as there were so many options. This includes the voters who dropped us in this, the MPs who kept trying to have their say and influence government(s) policy, the government who was supposed to have a policy, the civil service who were supposed to enact it and the EU who soon came to realise that our negotiations were not in the famed British style but just utter chaos. There was no hope for companies to react regarding labour movements they were too busy refreshing the Government Gateway website waiting for some real information to arrive.

Despite this some companies were reacting, they were busy stockpiling as much materials/goods as they could afford. They were however unable to magic up hundreds of thousands of workers in a pandemic with an unemployment artificially low due to furlough and an inability to train them.

Other companies, like mine could react far more easily. We simply closed lots of offices, made people redundant and moved their jobs to the EU or India, only the irreplaceable were left unscathed. Companies in the financial sectors did the same, even mid sized companies in the UK created EU offshoots to handle the lack of movement of goods. However, when it comes to things we eat or move around in the UK it is not possible to have those jobs in the EU, it has to be in UK and there is no workforce ready and willing to start work.

 

[Fab Foodie]

One alpaca gets newspaper headlines for weeks.
1000s of pigs needlessly slaughtered goes almost in acknowledged.

Yep, the way things are in this stupid country....

 

[Fab Foodie]

Priti Patel at the conference.... "And that's not all. We have finally ended free movement."
Applause from the Tories FFS.
She fecking sickens me.

Words fail....

 

[Rusty Nails]

The referendum result was 2016 (if memory serves). It is now 2021. So, regardless of Government action (which I would agree has hardly been impressive, Industry has had five years to make contingency plans, recruit staff, train staff etc etc. It would appear, they (Industry) have been asleep on the job. What a surprise, that has never happened before.

The fact that we have a bunch of incompetents, who could not organise a p*ss up in a brewery, as MPs (of all parties) is hardly news, when was it any different?

According to the Brexit leaders, and top Tory politicians like David Davies, the EU was going to be falling over itself to continue the beneficial trading terms that we had before. They need us more than we need them was their mantra.

Perhaps British industrialists were following the lead of our politicians in assuming that nothing much would change in trade. Even up to the very last minute.

Contingency plans are just that, contingencies, and no substitute for plans based on sound government advice ... which were in very short supply.

 

[mudsticks]

Yep, the way things are in this stupid country....

People often say

"Hur Hur.. Look at those 'dumb' 'muricans"

I really don't think the mentality of this country is far behind.

If behind at all.

The quality of the supposed ' news' spewed out by the 'popular' press is partly to blame I suppose.

But I think that 'dumbing down' has also been encouraged by governments rather preferring the electorate to aspire to being almost 'proud' of their ignorance .